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#93652 - 05/08/08 07:25 AM those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches
zilla
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Registered: 03/16/06
Posts: 753
Loc: Kingston, Jamaica

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Women lash dual citizenship flaws
'Butch' Stewart announces annual award for J'ca's most influential women
PETULIA CLARKE, Associate editor clarkep@jamaicaobserver.com
Thursday, May 08, 2008



Observer Chairman Gordon 'Butch' Stewart shares a joke with Miss Jamaica (World) 2007 Yendi Phillips, who was one of the guests at a special luncheon for women at the newspaper's Beechwood Avenue, Kingston offices yesterday. Stewart hosted women leaders for a talk back session to hear their views on issues affecting the country. (Photo: Joseph Wellington)

THE dual citizenship restriction that forced Daryl Vaz to renounce his United States citizenship and Danville Walker to resign his position as director of elections, was roundly condemned yesterday as "archaic and insulting".

Some of Jamaica's leading women in business lashed out strongly against the constitutional provision that disqualifies those holding a foreign passport and having dual citizenship from serving in certain key public offices.

The women, who attended a special luncheon hosted by Observer chairman Gordon 'Butch' Stewart at the Observer's Beechwood Avenue offices yesterday, called the laws an insult to those who had dual citizenship who wanted, and had the training, to give back to their country.

"When we were in the States, we were encouraged to get our citizenship so we could vote. Then we were encouraged to come home and contribute, and when you do, they tell you that you can't," complained Audrey Hinchcliffe, the current Jamaica Employers Federation (JEF) president.

Hinchcliffe, who admitted to holding US citizenship, said: "At no time were we told that there was a law (against dual citizenship). It's an insult to us who have contributed and who come back here trying to make a contribution... to come back here and hear this."

Stewart, who has been hosting a series of similar luncheons providing an outlet for various sectors of the Jamaican society to air their issues, used the opportunity to announce an annual event celebrating the "Most Influential Women in Jamaica", akin to the highly successful Business Leader Awards.

The hotel mogul said the event would single out "the women who have been working to transform the country and their communities, and the women who understand that their journey in life should not be self-serving, but should be dedicated to serving others".

"We want to highlight the women, from all parishes, who have touched lives, created hope and made an impact, the women who understand that being influential has less to do with position or title, or indeed random acts of kindness or charity, but from working towards a purpose and helping people gain meaning wherever they go," he said.

In the earlier discussion, Stewart paid tribute to Jamaican women whom he said could be relied on to speak up for what they believed in, irrespective of the cost.

Among the women in attendance were Thalia Lyn, CEO of Island Grill; Lorna Myers, CEO of Restaurants of Jamaica (Kentucky Fried Chicken); Audrey Marks, CEO of Paymaster; Becky Stockhausen, head of the American Chamber of Commerce; Minna Israel, managing director of RBTT; Yendi Phillips, Miss Jamaica (World) 2007; Naomi Francis of Nationwide Radio; Senator Dorothy Lightbourne, justice minister and attorney-general, and Pat Ramsay of the University of Technology (UTech).

The women commented on the dual citizenship issue and its repercussions for Jamaica, in light of the April 18 ruling that Vaz was not qualified to sit in the parliament, because of his allegiance to a foreign power, causing him to renounce his US citizenship; and Monday's resignation by Walker who chose to do that over renunciation.

Hinchcliffe argued that Vaz had erred and should have mounted a challenge instead of readily giving up his status.
"I'm really resentful about the argument and I'm now seeing dual citizenship as a bad word. How can you be dual in one sense, and excluded in another sense," she asked.

The women were almost unanimously opposed to the clause in the constitution and urged the powers that be to review it. One woman wondered what future could the country have under such a law, when so many young Jamaicans were holders of dual citizenship, whether it be for the US, Canada or elsewhere.

"My concern is in 10 years' time; most of our kids will have (other) citizenships, what will happen to them?" RBTT's Israel asked.

"What will happen to the university kids in 10 years?" CEO of Seaboard Jamaica, Corah-Ann Robertson-Sylvester also added. "They will be prevented from taking certain jobs, because of a contradictory law."

The women also pointed to the irony of the constitution not affecting Green Card holders who have a residency stipulation (and must return to the US periodically); while it comes down hard on those who are sometimes merely passport holders who don't have to satisfy residency requirements.

It was a point raised Tuesday by Vaz, who urged MPs with US Resident Alien or Green Cards to declare that too, saying that they had a moral obligation to do so.

"We don't have the numbers of people with the skills to exclude those willing to serve, with an archaic legislation that's an insult," Hinchcliffe added. "That needs to be looked at."

For her part, environmentalist Diana McCaulay sided with the constitution in as much as it allows for public servants not to hold dual citizenship. Citing her personal case where she is the only one in her family to hold only a Jamaican passport, she said the struggles, which include visa issues, makes one more appreciative of the need to be fully dedicated to the country to which one has allegiance


Most of dem only loyal to one thing MONEY . Thats Y i seh MOB fi life. We dont have the skill set? Here we go again. However once u go pon that plane and land in america ur suddenly bestowed with the skill sets!! No body with dual citizenship should serve in parliment. Sine dem a US citizen Y dem raasshole dont go to dem preferred country and try go in dem parliment or senate with dual citizenship. Unpatriotic b!tches, if america inna a war and ask dem fi fight, dem will immediately seh dem a jamaican, if going get tuff a jamaica dem a american. U cannot pledge allegiance to another country and dem want come run Jamaica. Go weh wid that . Thats Y a coward dies a thousand death but a soldiers dies just once!
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#93654 - 05/08/08 07:50 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: zilla]
scotty0196
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Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 613
Loc: Silver Spring,MD,USA

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I don't see the basis of their argument at all. I am certain the statute or terms were not created over night. Dyam bareface and bold, they can contribute and give back to their country under the rules of the country. As a matter of fact I think certain other Public Sector post should come under scrutiny too including the pow pow.
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#93656 - 05/08/08 08:00 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: scotty0196]
zilla
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Registered: 03/16/06
Posts: 753
Loc: Kingston, Jamaica

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Scotty u see di audacity!! Dis is Jamaica land I man love to death, not some wear and left. I dont av a problem wid dem having dem dual citizenship but conform to the laws of the country. Dont shift the goal post to suit sem selfish disires. All who pledge allegiance to anotther country and in parliment, please do the honourable thing and resign and go do unnu renouncement and come serve. Ur welcome!! Dem biatches deh fi go, as "el cappo now el kappo" would say, jump off a cliff, preferably one wid some hard hood, a mean rock at di base.

U eva notice dem condiscending behaviour wen dem deh amongst ordinary jamaicans (not white and or rich). Den in high profile functions and coctails dem a pure teeth and smiles even if u insult dem.


Edited by zilla (05/08/08 08:07 AM)
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#93658 - 05/08/08 08:54 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: zilla]
Chez
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Registered: 02/21/01
Posts: 3468
Loc: London, UK

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zilla, I agree with your stance on the citizienship issue.

However, there was no need to resort to sexism to get your point across.

No need to tag them as b*tches.

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#93660 - 05/08/08 09:23 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: Chez]
zilla
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Registered: 03/16/06
Posts: 753
Loc: Kingston, Jamaica

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 Originally Posted By: Chez
zilla, I agree with your stance on the citizienship issue.

However, there was no need to resort to sexism to get your point across.

No need to tag them as b*tches.

chez emotions tek ova sometime wen it come to certain issues
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#93665 - 05/08/08 10:44 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: zilla]
morefire1
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Registered: 03/22/01
Posts: 1087

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 Originally Posted By: zilla
Women lash dual citizenship flaws
'Butch' Stewart announces annual award for J'ca's most influential women
PETULIA CLARKE, Associate editor clarkep@jamaicaobserver.com
Thursday, May 08, 2008



Observer Chairman Gordon 'Butch' Stewart shares a joke with Miss Jamaica (World) 2007 Yendi Phillips, who was one of the guests at a special luncheon for women at the newspaper's Beechwood Avenue, Kingston offices yesterday. Stewart hosted women leaders for a talk back session to hear their views on issues affecting the country. (Photo: Joseph Wellington)

THE dual citizenship restriction that forced Daryl Vaz to renounce his United States citizenship and Danville Walker to resign his position as director of elections, was roundly condemned yesterday as "archaic and insulting".

Some of Jamaica's leading women in business lashed out strongly against the constitutional provision that disqualifies those holding a foreign passport and having dual citizenship from serving in certain key public offices.

The women, who attended a special luncheon hosted by Observer chairman Gordon 'Butch' Stewart at the Observer's Beechwood Avenue offices yesterday, called the laws an insult to those who had dual citizenship who wanted, and had the training, to give back to their country.

"When we were in the States, we were encouraged to get our citizenship so we could vote. Then we were encouraged to come home and contribute, and when you do, they tell you that you can't," complained Audrey Hinchcliffe, the current Jamaica Employers Federation (JEF) president.

Hinchcliffe, who admitted to holding US citizenship, said: "At no time were we told that there was a law (against dual citizenship). It's an insult to us who have contributed and who come back here trying to make a contribution... to come back here and hear this."

Stewart, who has been hosting a series of similar luncheons providing an outlet for various sectors of the Jamaican society to air their issues, used the opportunity to announce an annual event celebrating the "Most Influential Women in Jamaica", akin to the highly successful Business Leader Awards.

The hotel mogul said the event would single out "the women who have been working to transform the country and their communities, and the women who understand that their journey in life should not be self-serving, but should be dedicated to serving others".

"We want to highlight the women, from all parishes, who have touched lives, created hope and made an impact, the women who understand that being influential has less to do with position or title, or indeed random acts of kindness or charity, but from working towards a purpose and helping people gain meaning wherever they go," he said.

In the earlier discussion, Stewart paid tribute to Jamaican women whom he said could be relied on to speak up for what they believed in, irrespective of the cost.

Among the women in attendance were Thalia Lyn, CEO of Island Grill; Lorna Myers, CEO of Restaurants of Jamaica (Kentucky Fried Chicken); Audrey Marks, CEO of Paymaster; Becky Stockhausen, head of the American Chamber of Commerce; Minna Israel, managing director of RBTT; Yendi Phillips, Miss Jamaica (World) 2007; Naomi Francis of Nationwide Radio; Senator Dorothy Lightbourne, justice minister and attorney-general, and Pat Ramsay of the University of Technology (UTech).

The women commented on the dual citizenship issue and its repercussions for Jamaica, in light of the April 18 ruling that Vaz was not qualified to sit in the parliament, because of his allegiance to a foreign power, causing him to renounce his US citizenship; and Monday's resignation by Walker who chose to do that over renunciation.

Hinchcliffe argued that Vaz had erred and should have mounted a challenge instead of readily giving up his status.
"I'm really resentful about the argument and I'm now seeing dual citizenship as a bad word. How can you be dual in one sense, and excluded in another sense," she asked.

The women were almost unanimously opposed to the clause in the constitution and urged the powers that be to review it. One woman wondered what future could the country have under such a law, when so many young Jamaicans were holders of dual citizenship, whether it be for the US, Canada or elsewhere.

"My concern is in 10 years' time; most of our kids will have (other) citizenships, what will happen to them?" RBTT's Israel asked.

"What will happen to the university kids in 10 years?" CEO of Seaboard Jamaica, Corah-Ann Robertson-Sylvester also added. "They will be prevented from taking certain jobs, because of a contradictory law."

The women also pointed to the irony of the constitution not affecting Green Card holders who have a residency stipulation (and must return to the US periodically); while it comes down hard on those who are sometimes merely passport holders who don't have to satisfy residency requirements.

It was a point raised Tuesday by Vaz, who urged MPs with US Resident Alien or Green Cards to declare that too, saying that they had a moral obligation to do so.

"We don't have the numbers of people with the skills to exclude those willing to serve, with an archaic legislation that's an insult," Hinchcliffe added. "That needs to be looked at."

For her part, environmentalist Diana McCaulay sided with the constitution in as much as it allows for public servants not to hold dual citizenship. Citing her personal case where she is the only one in her family to hold only a Jamaican passport, she said the struggles, which include visa issues, makes one more appreciative of the need to be fully dedicated to the country to which one has allegiance


Most of dem only loyal to one thing MONEY . Thats Y i seh MOB fi life. We dont have the skill set? Here we go again. However once u go pon that plane and land in america ur suddenly bestowed with the skill sets!! No body with dual citizenship should serve in parliment. Sine dem a US citizen Y dem raasshole dont go to dem preferred country and try go in dem parliment or senate with dual citizenship. Unpatriotic b!tches, if america inna a war and ask dem fi fight, dem will immediately seh dem a jamaican, if going get tuff a jamaica dem a american. U cannot pledge allegiance to another country and dem want come run Jamaica. Go weh wid that . Thats Y a coward dies a thousand death but a soldiers dies just once!



Zilla, I man agree with u 100% star even though I man hold US Citizenship. Those Ladies have no beef as far as can see. " one cannot serve two Masters". Sometimes u have to wonder about these so called educated people. what the hell are they thinking. Maybe there was some misunderstanding along the way regarding the Dual Citizenship. "u cant have your Cake and Eat it to".


Edited by morefire1 (05/08/08 10:45 AM)

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#93668 - 05/08/08 10:58 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: morefire1]
Humble Lion
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Registered: 07/30/07
Posts: 544

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Yendi Phillips look good still \:D
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#93675 - 05/08/08 11:53 AM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: morefire1]
zilla
Member


Registered: 03/16/06
Posts: 753
Loc: Kingston, Jamaica

Offline
morefire having a us citizenship all good still. Eventhough we a forumite, if u a go represent the people in the senate or parliment u afi go give it up stil

Fi real HL, yendi sell off. A wonda if she would a give a brother a talk? Nah dont think so. A think a going to av to try get some money first
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#93679 - 05/08/08 12:19 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: zilla]
metro
Member


Registered: 01/30/08
Posts: 549
Loc: Bermuda

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I do not respect jamaican women
look at what merlene otti did,
represent jamaica to at one
point she was a leading sports
Icon.Then switch to estonia
and silly dunce head Portia
made a statue of her; typical
jakan women.


Edited by metro (05/08/08 12:40 PM)
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#93680 - 05/08/08 12:39 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: metro]
Jengs
Member


Registered: 06/17/01
Posts: 1375
Loc: West Lafayette IN ,USA

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 Originally Posted By: metro
I do not respect jamaican women
look at what merlene otti did,
represent jamaica to at one
point she was a leading sports
Icon.Then switch to estonia
and silly dunce head Portia
made a statue of her; typical
jakan women.


Are you serious? Why would you say that about all Jamaican women? Additionally, when Merlene switched to Slovenia she probably would not be able to make another Jamaican team. I don't think she switched because she hated the country, although she had some problems with other Jamaican athletes who protested her being chosen to run the 100m in the 2000 Olympics. Regardless of what you think, the women has served the country well!

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#93681 - 05/08/08 12:44 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: Jengs]
metro
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Registered: 01/30/08
Posts: 549
Loc: Bermuda

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yes, I am serious and am not going
any further with this.
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#93700 - 05/08/08 03:26 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: Jengs]
gary
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Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 1997
Loc: kingston, jamaica

Offline
 Quote:

Are you serious? Why would you say that about all Jamaican women? Additionally, when Merlene switched to Slovenia she probably would not be able to make another Jamaican team. I don't think she switched because she hated the country, although she had some problems with other Jamaican athletes who protested her being chosen to run the 100m in the 2000 Olympics. Regardless of what you think, the women has served the country well!


Agree.
Metro is very very wrong here and needs help.

1.Ottey will always be a Jamaican legend who gave Ja her best for 20 years. that is a fact. We don`t agree with all the decisions/mistakes she made, but that cannot undo what she has done for us. She kept the flag flying for 20 years, blood, sweat and tears. We cried and we celebrated with her.

She will always be our Queen.

And our new Queen, Veronica, says Ottey is the reason she does what she does. Ottey inspired her, like amny other Jamaicans.

She deserve that statue. Long lives the Queen.

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#93701 - 05/08/08 03:30 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: gary]
gary
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Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 1997
Loc: kingston, jamaica

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2. Re respectung Jamaican women?
Yes they are the most wonderful, strong and hardworking womena hand many have made our nation proud.

Yes we can do without the Lady Saws of ths world but you have many wonderful great Jamaiacn women like Ottey, Miss Lou, Mary Seacole, Veronica Campbell, Marcia Griffiths etc etc.

I think the lady who spoke in the article was rude and disrespectful to diss our laws but its not right to diss them/or all Yardie women in return.

While we are at it, big the lovely Jamaican women on this forum Bubblay and Princess.

Quite so.

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#93702 - 05/08/08 03:39 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: gary]
assasin
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Registered: 10/21/99
Posts: 963
Loc: spring valley ny 10977

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The last time I check Jamaica is a democracy and the woman them a be advocate for what they believe in.

How many a you will give your citizenship to serve?

I will serve but mi nah give up my citizenship as my family come before anything and anywhere in the world they are and in need I must be able to hop and a plane and go, mi nah beg nobody.

Ladies I support unnu 100%, do unnu thing. See how fast unnu ready fi call the woman them name? You wonder why we have problems in Ja? Because the loudest man win all di time, not the ones who are advocating for better.

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#93703 - 05/08/08 03:40 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: assasin]
assasin
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Registered: 10/21/99
Posts: 963
Loc: spring valley ny 10977

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Gary I am not a fan of slackness but Lady Saw smarter than you think. She can write and can be an advocate.

She only go on that way because that is what is selling and playing on the radio. Have you ever heard some of her better songs?

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#93704 - 05/08/08 03:58 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: assasin]
metro
Member


Registered: 01/30/08
Posts: 549
Loc: Bermuda

Offline
jamaican women have good Qualities, they are better at clensiness
than most, and cook better than most; But they do not give there partners the best loving and they cheat and carry your business a road . sorry.
_________________________
life is a journey not a vacation.

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#93705 - 05/08/08 04:26 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: metro]
scotty0196
Member


Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 613
Loc: Silver Spring,MD,USA

Offline
It is a democracy, not a hypocrisy. You are entitled to the freedom of speech and expression, but not to cercumvent laws to your advantage. That action bares the characteristic of an opportunist and dont put you much further that of a criminal.

I will take a Lady Saw, a Merlene Ottey any day over a hinchcliff or whatever she name cause mi know they are true to true to themself and to people.

If you are the holder of a dual citizenship you obtained that to enable you to get more opprotunities in the foriegn country. And you want to take advantage of an opprotunity in jamaica, you go according to the statutes related to the field. You know how many jamaicans qualify for positions held by some of those in that so called social class? Nuh wonda some a dem could a buss chat bout if PNP lose the election them a move weh. Please note I only throwing corn. Fowl come nyam!!!!

When it ask nationality on the application paper, I am almost certain dem only put jamaican. Yuh want to give back to jamaica and exploit the system no sah !!

IMO morality is a fluactuating standard without a clear definition just so folks like this hinchcliff can gwaan with F@#$RY with a clear concience.
tek weh yuself!!!
Character like these cant account for dem signature on building plans approving structures to be built in the direct flight path of planes landing in mobay. Characters like these take onthe responsibility of running Jamaica's airline for yeas without the airline receiving a cent for profit as it goes to your hotel. Butch Stewart a yu! mi a call out; and guise his actions under the whitehall controversy and use his newspaper to push his agenda. Character like these are all about the dollar not about giving back but gaining.
When yu give dont expect to receive, why yu a look reprive. Ole enamel!!


Edited by scotty0196 (05/08/08 04:28 PM)
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Scotty seh soh

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#93707 - 05/08/08 04:48 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: metro]
Jengs
Member


Registered: 06/17/01
Posts: 1375
Loc: West Lafayette IN ,USA

Offline
 Originally Posted By: metro
jamaican women have good Qualities, they are better at clensiness
than most, and cook better than most; But they do not give there partners the best loving and they cheat and carry your business a road . sorry.


You clearly have issues with our women. It makes little sense carrying on a discussion, but I hope you come to realize how wonderful our women are!

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#93710 - 05/08/08 05:47 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: Jengs]
assasin
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Registered: 10/21/99
Posts: 963
Loc: spring valley ny 10977

Offline
laws can be change and they are going about it the right way by advocating change. It is however up to the majority, there is no reson to disrepect the woman them for using the right channel.

If them did hide and say them a nuh citizen and look position then that would be the problem.

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#93712 - 05/08/08 06:03 PM Re: those selfish and unpatriotic b!tches [Re: assasin]
pHoQrY
Member


Registered: 07/24/00
Posts: 2198
Loc: Jamaica

content Online
all this time i thought metro was kidding around...but is true to rahtid

im is a jackass!
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