I CAN UNDERSTAND THE DISGUST BEEN EXPRESSED BY MANY FANS REGARDING THE 4-0 THRASHING MEXICO HANDED THE BOYZ ON SUNDAY.
I NOTICE THAN WHEN THE BOYZ WIN A GAME WE BIG THE TD, THERE WHEN THE BOYZ LOSE THE TD MUST TAKE REPONSIBILITIES. THE TD PICKS THE TEAM AND PLAN THE STRATEGY. SO HE MUST TAKE FULL REPONSIBILITY.
JAMAICA LOST THE GAME IN THE FIRST 15 MINS OF THE MATCH. THE TEAM DID NOT HAVE A PLAN DURING THIS 15 MINS PERIOD. IT SEEMS THAT THEY DID KNOW WHETHER TO ATTACK OR TO DEFEND. THE MIDFIELDERS WERE GOING FORWARD AND LEAVING BIG GAPS BETWEEN MIDFIELD AND DEFENCE. MEXICO BEING A GOOD TEAM SENSED THE CONFUSION/LACK OF COHESION. MAYBE THE TD COMMUNICATED THE PLAN BUT THE PLAYERS DIDNT UNDERSTAND IT OR MAYBE HE DIDNT. WHICHEVER, HE HAS TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.
IT WAS NOT UNTIL JAMAICA CONCEDED THE SECOND GOAL THAT THE TEAM DECIDED TO ATTACK THE MEXICANS. EVEN THOUGH WE DOMINATED THE REST OF THE FIRST HALF, WE ONLY CREATED TWO CLEAR CHANCES. ONE WAS CREATED BY LOWE AND THE OTHER WHEN ANDY PASS A THRU BALL TO BURTON. JAMAICA IS PLAYING WITHOUT A MIDFIELD AND WE WILL GET AWAY WITH IT AT HOME (WHERE THE ENERGY LEVEL IS HIGH) BUT THE GOOD TEAMS WILL LET US PAY. WE HAVE TO BLAME THE TD FOR HIS POOR SELECTIONS. WE HAVE PLAYERS WHO CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PARK. THE TD SHOULD SHOULD RECALL SIMPSON. YES THE HARD RUNNING AND HARD TACKLING FITZ SIMPSON. HE HAS PUNISHED THE YOUTH, IT IS TIME TO GIVE HIM A SECOND CHANCE. IT IS TIME TO RECALL SINCLAIR(UPON HIS RECOVERY). MY SUGGESTION IS THAT SINCLAIR SHOULD TAKE OVER THE LEFT BACK POSITION FROM BIBBI. BIBBI IS ABLE TO DO WONDERS FOR BOLTON BECAUSE THEY PLAY HIM IN THE BEST POSITION - MIDFIELD, NOT AS A DEFENDER. TWO OF MEXICO'S GOALS RESULT FROM BIBBI BEING DISPOSSESSED. IDEALLY, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SIMPSON & ANDY OR BIBBI & SIMPSON OR BIBBI & ANDYSTARTING IN MIDFIELD. WHITMORE SHOULD COME OFF THE BENCH. HE IS NOT THE SAME PLAYER AS 4 YEARS AGO. CLOVIS NEED TO ADDRESS THE PROBLEM WITH THE MIDFIELD NOW OR ELSE THE BOYZ WILL BE WATCHING THE WC FROM HOME....
I wouldn't throw around blame like that though. Whole lot of things going on and I actually thing the TD was trying to adjust to what he say during the game by adding in a third forward. I saw that the Mexico defense wasn't saying nothing, and after the two goal, we were stable in defense, which is why the added forward seemed like a good plan, I was thinking the same thing (which, as we all know, makes it an idea beyond reproach. heh heh ) BEsides we were getting to a point where we needed a goal being 2-0 down in the second half.
Who knew we would have suddenly fall apart and become disorganized. Problem was we couldn't control the ball in midfield and when mexico sent it back to our defense the missing extra man must have helped them out.
[This message has been edited by shaggybear (edited 03-26-2001).]
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Yes, Simpson would be an option.
But believe me you can't start defending on your own last third of the field.
Try to defend on your opponents half, and play off-side trap if need too. Mexico catch Jamaica a few times in the off-side trap.
Defending in yuor side of the field is dangerous. Jamaica did the same against Trinidad, and there they got away with it. But this a practice that you can't keep up at this level. Jamaica need tactical changes.
Remember, when the going get tough, the tough get going.
I believe that Simpson should be recalled. As I said in the other post, I believe that this problem in the midfield can be caused by Powell. We all know that Andy and Theo are good players, but what about Powell. Yes he plays in one of the best leagues in the world. Maybe Andy and Theo don't know how to play with him. Bring back Simpson in defensive midfield or William Wilson. Bibi should play left midfield and he need to have the ball because he is one of our playmakers.Im tired of the criticizing. Everybody is acting as sore-losers. Now you want to blame the TD. CHILL!!!!!!!!
DaBomber, you are missing the point. If Jamaica had lost 1-0 or 2-0 nil, this would be acceptable to most fans. A 4-0 nil thrashing was unthinkable going into the match. In order for boyz to move forward, the TD must have open dialogue with the team and accept that either the team didnt understand or misunderstood what the game plan was especially in the first 15-20 mins, when the boyz couldnt decide whether to attack or defend. He has to accept and take responsibility for the loss, after all he is the manager. I am not suggesting that he should be fired. But a big part of learning from ones mistake is accepting esponsibility and move on.
Regarding your suggestion that Whitmore and Andy cant play with Powel and that this maybe the source of the midfield problem. Nothing could be further apart from the truth. That is certainly not the reason why Andy and Whitmore are ineffective in midfield. You see Whitmore and Andy are two highly skilful players, who do not compliment each other. Both players are not very mobile and their work rate is very low. They are good when they have the ball and they become invisible when they dont have the ball. In the last world cup campaign, we had the same problem with the midfield, until Simoes brought in Simpson who turned out to be a perfect compliment for Tapper. Simpson would run his heart out, tackle and win the ball and pass to Tapper. My friends, Tapper has always fall asleep during games, but many of you are only seeing it now because Andy is sleeping too and their is no one working in the midfield. Simpson compliment Tapper the same way Alverz and Valderama complimented each other. The same way Davids compliments Zidane at Juventus, the same way Emanuel Pitt or Viera compliments Zidane in the French team. It for this reason why Tapper or Andy (two skilful players with low work rate) needs a workaholic beside them in midfield.
I have a few questions to ask. Did the TD made an error in substiting Hayles for Dawes? This substitution largely result in Mexico scoring the last two goals as the defence was thin. Shouldnt the substitutions had been be, Hayles for Andy (who was bust after 60 mins), Fuller for Burton (who was walking around with his hand at his waste after 70 mins), and JJ for Tapper(who was more visible in this game but wasnt passing the ball verywhere else but forward)??? Wouldnt the score line look better 2-0 rather than 4-0??? Will goal difference matter at the end of the competition??? Only history will tell if this was a serious miscalculation on the path of the TD??
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Greetings Forumites. I just finished watching the game for a second time and I will make my comments now that I am not blinded by my emotions. First of all I must say that I don't think the TD should be blamed for the disappointing loss. However, I think that he could have made some better adjustments after the first 2 goals. I am totally confused about the fact that he did not move Bibi into the midfield where he plays so well for his club. Bibi is one of my favorite Reggae Boyz but I must say that he played a terrible left back yesterday. That was a game he should try to forget fast. I was very happy that he made it out of that game without a red card. Andy Williams should have been pulled a lot earlier. He is a somewhat skillful player but he makes mental mistakes consistently. I hate to see a midfielder make so many mental mistakes playing at this level. I also think we need some midfielders who can run for 90 minutes on a field bigger than the one at the 'Office'. I was also surprised that the TD chose Lowe to kick the penalty but I have never been to a trainig session so who am I to comment on that. Burton could have missed it just as well so that is a mute point. On a more positive note, I was happy to see Bazza showing that he belongs on the team and I hope he starts as a withdrawn forward or midfielder from now on. From what I have seen yesterday, if the TD makes the right adjustments as far as the personnel is concerned we can beat any team home or away. This is the team I would be curious to see for the next game: Forwards - Burton, Lowe Midfield - Whitmore, Bibi, Hayles
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yes rusty Andy and Whitmore are not ineffective in midfield. Whitmore and Andy are two highly skilful players, who do not compliment each other. we didn't need simpson on sunday in mex. he has the players who has prove them self... check it, dawes could have been the holding midfielder while powell does the runing off the ball and whitmore does his thing. we need players like bibi/lawrence/marsall on the flanks, who can run at defenders. if the td has to sacrifice man like simpson in the name of discipline, then so be it. discipline is important. m johnson is a man we can also use from that group at sweeper.
By Earl Bailey HomeViewJamaica.com Sports Director Reporting from Mexico City, Mexico
Coach of the Reggae Boyz, Clovis de Oliveira, is unhappy that his team lost against Mexico in the Azteca on Sunday, but is satisfied with the performance of his team. In a press conference after the game, Clovis gave details of what happened. He said that after 20 minutes everything changed, and said that the missed penalty may have affected the team's moral.
Although he did not put all the fault at Onandi Lowe's feet, he did say that if the penalty were scored, the team would have been more motivated to get the second goal.
" After Antonio de Nigris' two goals, Jamaica started to play. We generated two chances, we missed a penalty, but I must say that this was not the major factor. The first few minutes decided the entire game," he said. He said the team is not dejected, "When we go on the field, we try to give our best.
Sometimes because of injuries or cards we are not able to count on all of our players, but we always demonstrate our best on the field in my opinion" He said he could not have guessed the outcome. "I could not have guessed that we were going to draw, win or lose. What I ask always is for the team to develop each time with tactical discipline and if the players do that I am satisfied."
Clovis said the Reggae Boyz will continue to fight for a spot in the World Cup, saying that only five countries are fighting for two spots. "Mexico are sure of their spot, as I have always said that their level is above us. We cannot say that we are better than anybody else, but at the same time, there is none better than Jamaica."
When questioned about who would take the rap for the loss Clovis said, "I am not going to penalise anybody, the Reggae Boyz project is one of unity and I would never isolate one case in particular. I will say that we are all to be blamed, including the technical staff and all the players."
When quizzed about the difference when Mexico play in Jamaica next September, Clovis said, "everybody knows that there are differences. The advantages that you have here do not exist there. In world football one knows that there is nothing like playing at home, and above all, we are now going six years without losing at home and nearly fifty games,"
Speaking of the missed chances he said, "we did not create many chances and Mexico used the chances they created. We missed an important opportunity, but in the end we lost but the struggle continues." He said the two goals in the beginning did the trick for Mexico. "After that we could not recover, we lost spirit and could not do much more."
bigfan, i want to tell you, that is an interesting line up that I wouldn't mind seeing myself. I actually thin kt that powell might be better as a back line defendeer as well.
I like it. Hayles, bibi, and whitmore in the midfield sounds very interesting. I assume hayles will be an attacking midfielder and bibi will be on the left side.
It's weird though becaue It think whitmore can do well in the middle and hayles would be better on the right.
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Respect Shaggy and thanks for your input. I was thinking Bibi on the left, Hayles in the middle and closer to the forwards, and Whitmore on the right side. Powell would be aligned on the right defense and Jaime on the left. I think that starting team would be tight. Note that my team is based somewhat on the fact that Marshall will be out for the next game.
I think you guys should pay a little more attention to what dutchman is saying..
Though your selection, Big fan might look good, the current space between midfield and defence seems to be the bigger problem.No mater who is in midfield they will be stretched... As rusty already pointed out,there is no leader.As Pdart did already state...When the going gets tough,our boys turn on each other.But then thats typical jamaicans mi hear.But the answers are definately on this forum.The defenders must have a system that they speak to each other and one man take control.Someone who tells the defence when to drop and when to step up.Who is the vocalists??? Them defenders are playing on the big scene.They must know this.So were they playing to strict orders? We may never know!! But for the future lets hope we see world class performances.
Funny though.. Looking at the boyz,they have enough personnel to be an attacking team, but cant score, and personnel to be a defensive team but leak simple goals..
Could it be true that we have two teams on the field as Dennis said. Or could it be as rusty said... The TD's fault??
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Reggae fans I wish to quote a sentence from Earl Bailey's report above. According to the report the TD said following "Mexico are sure of their spot, as I have always said that their level is above us"
Is the TD giving Mexico too much credit??? If you are going into match(war) with this kind of attitude towards your opposition havent you twice defeated yourself??? Has the TD ever heard of the the Great Jamaican Marcus Garvey and his teachings??? Could the TD have inspired the Boyz to kick Mexico ass, if in his heart he truly believe the Boyz didnt stand a chance???
We have some away matches coming up to USA and Honduras. If the Boyz lose these matches, is he going to conclude that these teams are better than the Boyz and throw in the proverbial towel??? Assuming these teams would take the other two spots.
Shame shame on those who blame blaME. THE BOYZ HAD A TOUGH MATCH. TOUGH CONDITIONS TO FACE. iF WE HAD SCORED THE TWO GOOD CHANCES THE GAME COULD HAVE BRRN COMPLETELY DIFFERENT . bIG UP THE t.d. MEXICO IS NOT 4 GOALS BETTER THAN JAM. ON A LOWER PLAYING FIELD AT WORST ITS A TIE. BIG UP THE BOYZ. WITHE MORE EXPERIENCE WE GONE CLEAR TO JAPAN/KOREA.HOW CAN YOU BLAME THE t.d FOR THE LACK OF CONFIDENCE OF THE PLAYERS? BURTON DONT HAVE CONFIDENCE? CONFIDENCE COMES THROUGH EXPERIENCE. MEXICO WAS A HIGH HILL TO CLIMB.
[This message has been edited by rasputin (edited 03-27-2001).]
[This message has been edited by rasputin (edited 03-27-2001).]
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"Men are disturbed not by events, but by the views which they take of them."
Rasputin, please read the TD comments again in the Earl Bailey report above, and tell if as the TD said, it is really 5 teams fighting for 2 spots. Tell me if you really believe Mexico qualify after playing only two games. Your "Shame, Shame" is misdirected.
Originally posted by rusty: I CAN UNDERSTAND THE DISGUST BEEN EXPRESSED BY MANY FANS REGARDING THE 4-0 THRASHING MEXICO HANDED THE BOYZ ON SUNDAY.
I NOTICE THAN WHEN THE BOYZ WIN A GAME WE BIG THE TD, THERE WHEN THE BOYZ LOSE THE TD MUST TAKE REPONSIBILITIES. THE TD PICKS THE TEAM AND PLAN THE STRATEGY. SO HE MUST TAKE FULL REPONSIBILITY.
JAMAICA LOST THE GAME IN THE FIRST 15 MINS OF THE MATCH. THE TEAM DID NOT HAVE A PLAN DURING THIS 15 MINS PERIOD. IT SEEMS THAT THEY DID KNOW WHETHER TO ATTACK OR TO DEFEND. THE MIDFIELDERS WERE GOING FORWARD AND LEAVING BIG GAPS BETWEEN MIDFIELD AND DEFENCE. MEXICO BEING A GOOD TEAM SENSED THE CONFUSION/LACK OF COHESION. MAYBE THE TD COMMUNICATED THE PLAN BUT THE PLAYERS DIDNT UNDERSTAND IT OR MAYBE HE DIDNT. WHICHEVER, HE HAS TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY.
IT WAS NOT UNTIL JAMAICA CONCEDED THE SECOND GOAL THAT THE TEAM DECIDED TO ATTACK THE MEXICANS. EVEN THOUGH WE DOMINATED THE REST OF THE FIRST HALF, WE ONLY CREATED TWO CLEAR CHANCES. ONE WAS CREATED BY LOWE AND THE OTHER WHEN ANDY PASS A THRU BALL TO BURTON. JAMAICA IS PLAYING WITHOUT A MIDFIELD AND WE WILL GET AWAY WITH IT AT HOME (WHERE THE ENERGY LEVEL IS HIGH) BUT THE GOOD TEAMS WILL LET US PAY. WE HAVE TO BLAME THE TD FOR HIS POOR SELECTIONS. WE HAVE PLAYERS WHO CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PARK. THE TD SHOULD SHOULD RECALL SIMPSON. YES THE HARD RUNNING AND HARD TACKLING FITZ SIMPSON. HE HAS PUNISHED THE YOUTH, IT IS TIME TO GIVE HIM A SECOND CHANCE. IT IS TIME TO RECALL SINCLAIR(UPON HIS RECOVERY). MY SUGGESTION IS THAT SINCLAIR SHOULD TAKE OVER THE LEFT BACK POSITION FROM BIBBI. BIBBI IS ABLE TO DO WONDERS FOR BOLTON BECAUSE THEY PLAY HIM IN THE BEST POSITION - MIDFIELD, NOT AS A DEFENDER. TWO OF MEXICO'S GOALS RESULT FROM BIBBI BEING DISPOSSESSED. IDEALLY, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SIMPSON & ANDY OR BIBBI & SIMPSON OR BIBBI & ANDYSTARTING IN MIDFIELD. WHITMORE SHOULD COME OFF THE BENCH. HE IS NOT THE SAME PLAYER AS 4 YEARS AGO. CLOVIS NEED TO ADDRESS THE PROBLEM WITH THE MIDFIELD NOW OR ELSE THE BOYZ WILL BE WATCHING THE WC FROM HOME....
What is the status of Simpson and Sinclar brethren?
_________________________ Life is a journey, not a destination
Some people will always see a glass as half empty rather than being half full. I am surprised that the motivational and inspirational aspect of Clovis's statement is misunderstood by this member. As Educators and leaders we must continually derive new ways and maximize all opportunities to inspire and motivate the charges that we lead. I am sure that from experience we know how to deal with our children, our peers and I am prepared to give the TD enough credit where that is concerned. The success of the team is his success, so too their failures. Its mind boggling that someone could seek to represent it in the way that this 'FAN' has. Lets be logical and give credit where it is due
Quote:
Originally posted by rusty: Reggae fans I wish to quote a sentence from Earl Bailey's report above. According to the report the TD said following "Mexico are sure of their spot, as I have always said that their level is above us"
Is the TD giving Mexico too much credit??? If you are going into match(war) with this kind of attitude towards your opposition havent you twice defeated yourself??? Has the TD ever heard of the the Great Jamaican Marcus Garvey and his teachings??? Could the TD have inspired the Boyz to kick Mexico ass, if in his heart he truly believe the Boyz didnt stand a chance???
We have some away matches coming up to USA and Honduras. If the Boyz lose these matches, is he going to conclude that these teams are better than the Boyz and throw in the proverbial towel??? Assuming these teams would take the other two spots.
_________________________ Life is a journey, not a destination
Yo Rusty I will take back one shame.You make a reasonable point. I agree with most of what the T.D. said though. No I don't think that Mexico gone clear. But! I do respect the heart and experience that Mexico has, always had , even with their most mediocre teams like this one. Remember the game against Germany In the last W.C? Remember the time we played them in the Gold Cup and lost in the last couple of minutes? We lost that one "simply" because of our "failure" to cover the quick restart. Luis Hernandez got a pass directly in front of the goal. It was over. Their teams always have a workhorse attitude. Every ball and every play to the last whistle is contested. I dont mean to try to preach brethrin, and I am sure that you know the game better than I do and Iknow that the Boyz also have heart .We saw that on Sunday. Maybe this is what Clovis thinks. How many international games has the Boyz played since the last W.C.? How many have Mexico? I KNOW that The boyz has, as a team ,more skill than Mexico. Do we have their colllective experience?
Two Love
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"Men are disturbed not by events, but by the views which they take of them."
) BEsides we were getting to a point where we needed a goal being 2-0 down in the second half.
