Well, we have the rights to them as otherwise we would not be able to get them. Apart from when there are suspensions in the league (EPL) then there are always going to be important games so there are always going to be controversies. But how often do we request the players? As far as I see, we should have their services when we want - and definitely for all World Cup qualifying games. Read below:
SMITH SLAMS JAMAICAN FA OVER KEY DUO
Jim Smith has blasted the Jamaican Football Association and accused it of abusing the fixture calendar.
The Derby boss will be robbed of the services of skipper Darryl Powell and striker Deon Burton for the FA Cup clash against Blackburn Rovers on Saturday as both players have been called-up for their national side.
And the duo could also miss the Rams' crucial Premiership match against Charlton on Tuesday.
"Jamaica abuse the fixture calendar more than most. They are playing two games while everyone else has one and they should know better than that as most of their players come from English leagues anyway," he said on his personal website.
"The players are playing two games out there so there is a distinct possibility they will miss the Charlton game as well. That's a joke.
"It must be a tough decision for the players to make. They have the choice of playing for the people who pay their wages in an important cup game or they can play for their country.
"In fairness they shouldn't be in a position where they have to decide."
Derby will also be without influential on-loan star Taribo West at Ewood Park as he is on international duty with Nigeria, while Scot Craig Burley and defender Chris Riggott are both suspended.
And Smith believes it is time the clubs who pay players' wages are protected.
"The football federations have got to get together and try to come to some arrangement that won't affect the players' club too much," he said.
Burton and Powell are in line to play in the Reggae Boyz' friendly matches against Bolivia on Friday and Bulgaria on Sunday, although Bolivia are believed to be struggling to field a side in Miami as only eight of their players have turned up for training.
Registered: 01/04/01
Posts: 611
Loc: London, England
Offline
tell Jim Smith his can go and kiss my big red FA. i dont see him making this same noise when England calls up their players for World Cup duty. please post his web address so we can tell him where to get off.
I can't see why it is such a problem either, whenever England is playing a qualifying game or Int'l friendly the entire leauge is off.I personally sent him an email on his reaction.
I would have to beg to differ from you guys and if U have Jims email number let me have it to show him not all Jamaicans think a like.
Maybe you guys should try and put yourself in Jims shoes....(No disrespect brethrens,jus try and see my point.)
Fourth from bottom and three points outside the relegation zone.FA cup fi bring likkle monies and a crucial game against middle of the table Charlton..If they lose on Tuesday,it will definately hurt.Progression in the Cup brings in xtra dollars..But with a squad full of internationals U do resign yourself to losing them once in a while but as a manager,how do U accept losing key players to friendly internationals that dont really affect the price of peanuts knowing that U pay these players,and will be without thier services (not due to injury)and you are struggling at the bottom of the league...And in the back of your mind you realise they can be injured also b4 they return for club duty.
Jim was not against us having to arrange friendlies but could not understand why we have to arrange two friendlies while others have arranged less according to him(not to sure how tru that is)
In my opinion,the JFF can flex thier muscles all they want-- but communication and co-operation is key...As we depend on these english based players we should be careful on how we demand thier services...his is part of the reasoning behind the new deals that state..."pick club or country"...This sort of behaviour will encourage these deals plus slow down the importation of Jamaican grown talent to the English game...The JFF need to flex more carefully.
It takes Jamaica far to long to establish this chemistry and physics shit within the team..Trust me....Practice games,friendlies,internationals,whatever... we depend on the same players while starving the waiting talent..Then when the ever present players become injured or tired we have no one to fill thier shoes bcoz they dont have enuff exposure or experience.
ANOTHER REASON WHY WE NEED A SECOND ELEVEN.
I heard about Bolivia's predicamant...I remembered when I slagged off the JFF for picking them as opponents.It will be a low blow and off the point if I waded in with punches now.
But the JFF as I have always said DO NOT THINK B4 THEY ACT....A camp in England would of helped situations.(Seeing that we have the qualifiers and need the clubs co-operation.)Two games and not even in the same place...Were they really thinking of the jetlagged players or making a quick dollar or answering the pressuring fans...??????????????
_________________________
They make the world so hard
Oh yeah...The sooner we realise that the Europeans set the football rules the better...Football leagues in Europe are planned around the league just as TV and football plan when it comes to viewing space...How can we as developing nations expect to progress in the football world if we cant grasp them things(I am no expert).
We either have to work with thier system or develop a system that helps us and not hinder our progress.....
For example...Develop a second eleven so we have ready made replacements or plan our leagues around the European leagues so they all blend.
European leagues have money...Money talk...we nuh have nuthen...
Those clubs in England can get nasty...
And those boys want to be playing,not sitting on benches....
Players have chosen Clubs over Country coz they know where thier bread buttered...
The number of players that choose country over club to enhance thier career is growing.
Jamaica and those who think politics will always be separate from football better be aware!!!!!
_________________________
They make the world so hard
JT, I could not agree with you more. The JFF must realize that there has to be a spirit of cooporation. To call them up for two friendlies at a time when they might be relegated is unwise and will create anymosity. I would have called them up for one game only and used the other game to look at some of our other players. This time JT, I will support you in critizing the JFF in what really, is a bad public relations move.
JT and JahB I disagree with you both. Firstly consider the following. Trinidad, USA, Mexico, Costa Rica, Colombia (and the list goes on) are all playing the same (if not more) friendly warm ups in preparation for the quallies - and all are using their 'top' side..no complaints (check fifa.com for confirmation on that if in disbelief. Secondly, the JFF is NOT at fault for the timing of the games. These games were arranged before Derby was 3 points from relegation so the JFF would have to be prophets to predict not to call up these players because their clubs would be facing relegation battle. Next, for about two years after the 98 world cup, Simoes played a host of games, and there were hardly any English based players in the squads. Players like Burton, Powell, Sinclair etc were rarely seen, and Simoes was greatly criticised for playing without our best team. The truth is, he was nurturing and exposing new talent. People like Altimont Butler, E. Bunsie, Ray Graham, Patrick Graham, Ricardo Scarlet (and again the list goes on) were the players playing EVERY game the national side had scheduled - and we lost many of them. Now when Simoes was doing that, his timing was perfect. The world cup qualifiers were a far way off so why not 'bring di youts'. Now coach Clovis has come to the side a few weeks before the quallies, and you expect him to continue in the same fashion? Is it that you expect him to just call up these players 3 days before each qualifier, without any additional practice together, and you expect Chemistry to automatically be present? Well Clovis is the one who the fingers would be pointed at and he knows that while he can do some experimenting (not calling Boyd, Sinclair, etc. and calling Wilson, Wolfe etc), he must maintain a level of chemistry among the top 20+ players who will be in this camp. I don't think even one game would be good enough! The 16-Nation tournament in India is what a true warm up is like so Jim Smith can celebrate that the JFF pulled out of that. A team like Argentina can do experimenting all year 'round as they can pick about 5 A teams, we can't. We have to build up to that point slowly (as was the trend Simoes started at the right time and I am sure Clovis will continue once the meeting in Japan/S. Korea is done). Brethren, I do understand that Derby are in a predicament, facing relegation, and Smith has all right to be concerned, but we are facing an even greater battle and it's better to go all out from the beginning that to wait until the final 4 or so games and realise that we are not in a confortable position to qualify and then we start panicking. It sounds delerious but this is the foresight which we must encourage and not suffer myopically. Hail the Boyz.
I think the JFF should have only called on one of the Derby County player for these international games.Although the coach need to have the players together he already know what both players have to offer,so he should be looking at new players for these two positions.It would be nice if he could let Daryll Powell or Deon Burton go back to England after the game Friday,so that one of them will be able to play for Derby against Charlton on Tuesday.
Russian, honestly, I don't mind that suggestion. Maybe Powell could go back to captian the side and play Lawerence/Wilson. But if this does not happen I definitely will not hold Clovis up for it because we need as much practice together as is possible...but I do understand Jim Smith's sentiments.
This is the kind of problem that does not have an easy solution. Today it is Derby tomorrow it may be Bolton Wanders. The best thing is to have good open communication between the Football Federations and the Clubs. The clubs do have a right to expect players to be available to them in times of need, especially since they pay their salary. At the same time clubs cannot deny players the opportunity to represent their country. The English clubs definately will not have a problem if their best players are taken to represent England right now. So early, open communication between the clubs and Countries is needed. The JFF arranged these games because it was convenient for the JFF and Bolivia and Bulgaria. Bulgaria is playing Mexico tonight, after which they will fly to JA for the Sunday game. It made sense to arrange the Bulgaria game close to the time Bulgaria plays Mexico since they are already in this part of the world. Having two games close together will also reduce the amount of travelling the English based players have to do. The TD, Burrell and Horace Reid will be flying to England immediately after the Bulgaria game on Sunday to discuss this very issue. Why can't the English based players, especially Burton and Powell, leave at the same time and be available to play on Tuesday? Communication, professionalism and respect are needed here, but the JFF have to look out for the interest of the Boyz first. peace
Bars...I think the JFF is looking out for themselves,not the players...example..I am sure if these guys would not be penalised or lose thier place in the squad a few of them would stay and represent the club...Gardner was reported as such...
Lepimi,exactly what russian say is what I am speaking of...compromise.
Its not our fault,certain clubs have more than one reggeaboy but on the same strength,it wont be the clubs fault if they choose not to hire any reggaeboys for security or business reasons in the future...
Footballer like to play ball,especially when the stakes high...Play for Jamaica and your club team replaces U,make it to the FA cup final and win and you dont play in the big show all bcoz the manager vex...and U had to go to Ja bcoz U had no choice....Or you get injured and JFF naw compensate you...
World Cup only brings us glory Lepimi...The likkle monies dont seem to go far judging from past experiences...Thats why the World Cup squad need players down for the glory(whitmore)and not players who are after monies(DJ)and thats why it is necessary to have a balance and not mash up a man food(job) bcoz we crave for glory...Trinidad are in England or are supposed to be....Costa Rico..I can only think of Wanchope...Man City can cover for a few games...But we are proposing to take Derby's heart and captain bcoz we think our teams chemistry is more important than derby's survival...and for two games....and not even in the same place...so they travel to Jamaica...then to miami..then back to jamaica...and then back to england...
I think we are being unreasonable and greedy....There are some long memories in football....
_________________________
They make the world so hard
So we have a game scheduled on friday in Miami, and on Sunday in Jamaica. The first qualifying game is a month away and there are no more practice games after the Sunday game. What do you propose? Call which players when?
I propose we start thinking of how we gonna get around the problem of English managers not giving contracts to Jamaicans bcoz they cant take the problems that go with it...
Trust me Lepimi...We do need our players but you sound like you expect Jim to feel like we do and say "yeah man...Jamaica team is more important than anything in the world and when Derby get relegated Jamaica will give me a job."
Jus maybe if they planned the pre training games better (as I said b4,come to England or tour Europe)then maybe...
Coz trust me we dont want Jim to start gwaan funny when we do really need Powell and Burton...
_________________________
They make the world so hard
Jt, twice in this thread and more times in another I have said I understand Jim Smith's 'sentiments' and 'concern'. But you have not given me a credible proposal. As I said, Derby was not in this position when these games were scheduled. Also, I don't know but I don't think it is that easy for the JFF to get up and play all friendlies in England. And if that is not what you mean, then what do we do for the friendlies that wont be playing in England? What should we do when a couple months before the quallies we get a new coach who is burdened with taking us to the World Cup so he does not have much time to experiment and play younger plaers and just call a 'best 11' for a qually game? As fas as this is concerned, the only time players could play for Jamaica is when the European season is on suspension, and the only time the European seasons are on suspension is when world cup qualifying games are in place for the European teams, and luckily for us FC's world cup schedule now fits UEFA's. So in other words, practically EVERY time we want to play a friendly game the English clubs will have league/FA Cup/Worthington Cup games and wont want to let the players go. SO what do we do? Only call the players for a world cup qualifying game? And the next thing, I guess Derby will be facing relegation trouble all season long so that makes it even more certain not to ever call Burton nor Powell unless it is for a WC qually when league wont be in play right? By the way, when was the last time Burton/Powell came to play for Jamaica? Correct me if I am wrong but I think it is 4 months..so how long should we wait before we schedule a friendly for those two specifically to play in? 5 months? Never? WC quallies alone?
c'mon jt, How all of a sudden u trun sympathiser...u of all the people that demand so much from the team, and is one of their fiercest critics..however all in good spirit though..as u like us...want to see them do well...Bigger point where was Jim Smith when we were NOT playing any friendlies and we did not call them. C'mon people let us get serious when was the last time them man play for us. Not to mention the fact that burton was suspended too...even better news for Smith at the time. Bigger point I hope that they get thru this weekend or else u know who is going to be the scapegoat (s)....hint...his(their) name(s) starts with D!!!!
I don't think JT put forward a proposal because it certainly is not an easy situation...but he has come up with a VALID point. If you guys notice, we have two or three reggae boyz who have been FORCED by contract to eschew international games for their club.....
If we don't come up with something and keep taking [e.g. Derby's] players from club games when they are facing relegation I can guarantee that their future contracts will contain provisions which address international play, and then where will we be.
Was it Paul Hall and I can't remember the other guys who got into problems with such contracts.
PEACE!!!! (Bwoy it cold round yah...but I will be at the game Friday night)
DART...It probably going crowded round a orange bowl. might even brush gainst you inna de squeeze an spill likkle beer pon you new shirt... A nuh nutten personal...heh heh...
_________________________
Obama/Biden 2012 - We need people who actually think in charge, though they should learn to lead!
Bwoy mi shame fi seh mi nah go to the game an mi live ina Ft. Lauderdale ( I was there at the Gold Cup though!!) but the main reason I wont be going is religion...I'm an Adventist so Friday nights are out. Mi a go tek a listen on homeviewjamaica though! :-). Anyway, considering the current situation, here is Horace Reid's response to the situation. Taken from today's gleaner:
While Smith is blasting the Jamaica Football Federation (JFF), general secretary of the JFF and general manager of the football teams, Horace Reid is expressing surprise at his outburst. In Reid's eyes the JFF has been more than accommodating and understanding towards the clubs of the overseas-based players and in particular Derby County.
"I am very surprised at Mr Smith's utterances... especially when we have cooperated consistently with all the clubs and more specifically with Derby County," said a very calm Reid. "We understand that with the situation at Derby he certainly would be under pressure and this may very well be a reaction to this pressure but we refute any allegation that we are not being reasonable.
"That is absolutely far from the truth.
"This Federation has been more than reasonable with our considerations. We have always tried our utmost best to cooperate with the clubs overseas and in fact we have tried our endeavour best to plan our events where as much as is possible there is little disruption to the club fixture," continued Reid.
The man who runs the day to day activities at the Federation office added that obviously there will be occasions where countries and clubs will have conflicts over dates but this he said is usually due to variables outside of the control of the Federations. One such variable Reid said "is the availability of good overseas opponents". "There certainly will not be another opportunity between the games this weekend and the game against Trinidad and Tobago. We may not have another opportunity to see these players and again we were very considerate when we planned those two games close to each other so we would not stretch out the time period where we would have these players away from their clubs," explained Reid.
"Given consideration to the players and their commitments to their clubs we have gone ahead to book their departure for the same evening after the game at a greater cost to us so that they can arrive in London on the morning of the 29th and long before their game on the evening of the 30th."
Jamaica is using the friendly matches to prepare for the resumption of their 2002 World Cup qualifying campaign at the end of February.
"The players shouldn't be in a position where they have to decide whether to play for club or country," he said.
"I think the football federations have got to get together and try and come to some arrangement that won't affect the players' clubs too much."
As I said, there will always be a conflict between club & country as long as the leagues are not suspended, which only occurs for World Cup games. Given that case it would be unwise to never call these players since they have club obligations, and if one should be more specific to say Derby is an exclusion and they should have their players because they are faced with relegation, then what if they are confronted with relegation all season long! Which is highly possible! Would it be suggested then to never call Burton nor Powell? Doesn't seem wise to me. Calling them once in 4 months is more than fair, plus they only miss one game as they go back on Sunday after the game, which as Reid mention, will cost the JFF more - but they are being as considerate as they can given the situation. hey, Bolivia beat Mexico 2-0 so we need our ammunition fi kill dem a yard! Peace.
Registered: 01/04/01
Posts: 611
Loc: London, England
Offline
Jim Smith feeling regulation blues das why him arun up him mouth. But theris no easy solution to this problem which is faced by ALL clubs with foreign players so JFF should'nt feel no way. I can remember Arsnel and Chelsea bawl when Nigeria have WC and Olympic games. Fergie lick out when England and Ireland have games too, and Man U are usually at the top of the league, so nuten no funny fe club coach mek noise. Mek we see wha happen when England have TWO friendly games a come up. Club coach a go vex, but wha fe do? man an man wa play fe them country too. Nuh fret bout man nah go get contract bcoz a this. if player good, contract wi come and coach all over the world will jus have to live with it bcoz there is no solution. 1LOVE
As Reid points out, especially with Derby we have been very cooperative. Once we had qualified for the second round we stopped using Powell. The last game Burton played for yard was because Derby released him stating he was not needed at the time. He had been playing in reserve games only, and wasn't even on the bench for Premiership games. Derby released him and requested to keep Powell as they were in a relegation fight. They've been hovering around the relegation zone all season. JFF said OK, didn't call Powell and used Burton only because Derby didn't need him. Now they want to make a big fuss. I understand the whole issue, but I think clubs are always going to complain, because they are paying the wages. It's tough and can have long term negative impact on the players, when contract time comes around.
Remember too, that to get a work permit in England the player has to represent his national team in 75% of their games over the previous year. As many people have said FIFA needs to step in and provide a uniform calendar for leagues and international fixtures and tournaments. This way CONCACAF and Europe have World Cup qualifying and other international tournaments at the same time. Then the English league would be off when we have games.
I still stick to my guns...Well AK47 actually...Heh heh...Easy Lepimi...As Shaggy said I never offered any solutions and I dont think I can...I was merely asking the man dem to understand Jims position and not vilify him...But I was not putting our concerns on the back row...Off course they are important to us but what I was trying to point out is that this problem will never go away with all parties quarrelling coz checking it really...There is no right and no wrong in this case jus mere consultations and consideration with compromise on both sides until amalgamation is reached by thetwo governing bodies(and hopefully these bodies are working on the problem)
In other words instead of cussing Jim,lets jus shout him and say thanks...A nuh nuthen Jim...U dun know...
A soft answer turneth away wrath...
GCM...I am sure Powell was injured them last few games why he never played...
_________________________
They make the world so hard
